shifting clusters

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Jfout
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shifting clusters

Post by Jfout » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:40 am

so i have a medium sized project. 140 scans.
at first i registered first floor into a cluster. then second floor into a cluster but when i tried to tie them together thier common wall didnt line up. or the columns.
so i broke them into smaller clusters. started at one end went up a stair case and tied second floor in. then slowly added the smaller clusters on each floor. all the while moving them in and out of a master cluster. everything seemed to be fitting together really well. i got almost halfway down the building and tied the floors together by 3 different staircases. then all of a sudden i went to overlay the clusters to take a look at them and one had shifted some random 40ish feet. this happens occasionally when pushing and pulling clusters in and out of other clusters but i dont know what is causing it. why dont they hold their registration? i am using the "move and keep postion" when moving them around but they still sometimes randomly shift way out of wack, sometimes they show the red lines connecting points/planes picked. i dont understand the scene workflow. where does it get these random locations its moving the clusters to? sometimes if you open a 3d view with all the clusters and move one into a different cluster you can just watch it flip to a different orientation.
i guess you could say my project is a clusterf###! i am way over budget and way beyond schedule.
can someone please explain their workflows? i am using primarily cloud to cloud unless it gives me "failed registration" then i use manual.
does the problem arise because of mixing registration methods?
any advice is greatly appreciated.
John Fout
VDC Manager
Russell

modeling/animation/scanning/drones. the four pillars of life. :ugeek:

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sreed
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Re: shifting clusters

Post by sreed » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:02 am

I feel your pain!

Something we do more regularly for exactly this reason is create artificial control files and break up the project into smaller lsproj projects. It sounds like you want it broken up anyway...

Once you have a backbone or tightly registered cluster complete, export the spheres or checkerboard targets coordinates. (Taglabs exporter makes this a breeze). Then use this csv file as a reference for other clusters. This workflow gives higher weighting to known targets and doesn't risk breaking apart clusters, and doesnt take long to find registration as it's only using the handful of control points.

I'm curious if anyone else has a better theory. Interesting use of "Force Current" command in another recent post. I have no experience with this seemingly obvious step.

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Jfout
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Re: shifting clusters

Post by Jfout » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:47 am

appreciate the response.
i had to abandon registration by targets(sphere/checkerboards) i am too green with scene and i couldn't figure out how to get things to fall back together once scene throws the clusters way apart and then has the tension strings floating between the correspondences. ended up deleting targets and re registering most of it cloud to cloud.

i was able to revert to a few hours ago when things were working fine.

is there a solid way to make clusters remain in place no matter if i move them into other clusters? locking them keeps them together i think. but it doesn't keep their registration if you pull them into another cluster. i feel like it has something to do with the scan managers in the cluster they are being moved too? maybe deleting those scan managers will allow them to stay in place?

i dont want to give up on scene, but i have experience with other software that can do this sort of registration in a third of the time this is costing me. it might be worth the cost of it to switch. anyway we have scene for the rest of the year, if i cant figure something out i will probably switch.
John Fout
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Russell

modeling/animation/scanning/drones. the four pillars of life. :ugeek:

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Re: shifting clusters

Post by blazaj » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:08 am

Hi John,

I don't know if this helps your case, but I always used to name several targets manually and force correspondences by names. For example I had floor A in a locked c2c cluster and floor B in another locked c2c cluster. I either used checkerboards, spheres or planes fitted to walls etc. at the adjoining scans between each floor. I named only couple of these targets to lock the correspondences and did the final target registration between the locked clusters - floors in the end. Only this way I was able to register large jobs. The last job I registered in Scene was app 2500 scan survey of a railway station. It worked out in the end, but after this experience I migrated to other software anyway and don't look back.

Regards
Jiri

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Jfout
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Re: shifting clusters

Post by Jfout » Fri Mar 15, 2019 1:28 pm

thanks for the reply.
i originally had them registered by floor and thought to tie them in by stairwells (with targets)
but when i overlayed them the registration for second floor drifted south slightly over 600 ft. first floor did not.
obviously looking at the building 2nd floor exterior wall didnt deviate from first. and the columns didnt line up.
so i had to re-approach clustering and see the floors as a single cluster split up vertically.

i finally got this thing registered. took me twice as much time as it did to scan. i will take the blame for about 8 hours of fubar but a lot of the extra time was trying to work around Scene saying...hey...since you moved that cluster into this folder its now 50 feet away and rotated 32 degrees from where it was.

:(
John Fout
VDC Manager
Russell

modeling/animation/scanning/drones. the four pillars of life. :ugeek:

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