Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

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MalteHC
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Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Thu May 17, 2018 9:01 am

Hi All

I have measured a scanning position with a totalstation and got the RTK position to the same scanning position.
Now my question is if it is possible to use the totalstation measurement of the scannerposition in the cyclone registration?
After the registration is done, i would like to translate the scaningstations upon the RTK measurement, there the geometry between the different scanstations is keept from the totalstation measurement.

Anyone who has any experience in this field?

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by jamesworrell » Thu May 17, 2018 12:17 pm

If I understand correctly .. yes.

Did you also use targets? OR are you relying on cloud-to-cloud for orientation?

Either way you need to create "constraints" between the scans for the registration.

First step is to import your TS control to create a scanworld .. simple Pt,X,Y,Z type thing. Does your measured control include height of instrument - that is did you measure with a prism and smart handle on top of scanner and put that in as height of target? Or did you measure via normal traverse, and have a height of target off the ground? If ground, add to match the height of instrument - assuming you did standard setup on the scanner - so the centre of the scan is 0,0,0. StdSetup is 0,0,0 at scanner centre - you just need "control" to match.

Probably a few ways to tackle the next step - and someone more enlightened might have an easier way.

If you have targets - skip this bit - just use the target coordinates .. that is a different answer. Assuming no targets ..:

In each scan - create a vertex at 0,0,0 and add a Registration Label that matches it's control point ID - needs to match exactly - also case sensitive. (You could go -Z offset here to match the ground position as opposed to adding the instrument height in previous step)

How big is the site? Are you planning on using ground distance coordinates or grid/geodetic coordinates? Or are you looking to apply a scale factor to the rtk coordinates? I assume you haven't used a P40 here and applied a scale factor during scanning ..

We typically pick a scale point and calculate a scale factor .. to translate the GPS coords to ground.

Going with ground .. you should have a control scanworld with the control points matching the instrument centres on a local assumed system.

Create a registration.

Add the control scanworld.

Add the other scanworlds.

Auto-add constraints - target ID only. This should basically match up the scanner centre with your control by name. Now you haven't got a rotation for the scan unless you also used targets. Then you head into the cloud-to-cloud world .. visual align .. wizard .. take your pick. You can give this a lesser weight to ensure the total station values have a higher priority.

So once you have the cloud-to-cloud added - you have constraints for the centre and rotation from cloud .. You can auto-add cloud as well.

Freeze rego .. you are on local coords .. audit it.

Next - to get to a pseudo real world - albeit ground distance coordinates .. pick one of the RTK positions - probably near the middle (we usually aim for a permanent survey mark) .. calculate the azimuth to a second - prob furthest away .. you can then set coordinates by 2 points .. pick point 1 (middle) .. then 2 .. run the command .. type in coords .. type in bearing .. done.

Set default scan world coords .. save the coord system etc.

If you want to use RTK across the thing and try and stretch/shrink the data .. instead of TS control - use the RTK coords. You might put more weight on the cloud-to-cloud then and average the overall position. There is no nice way to do this and to be honest - never had to try.

Hope this helps.

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by James Hall » Thu May 17, 2018 3:30 pm

In cyclone you can replace the Known Coordinate Scan world. The RTK coordinates or the Total station coordinates would be interchangeable.
Navigator window, file Import txt file. (.svy) It has formatting options you will have to play around with to get your Nothing, Easting and Units right.
Specify "Target ID" as you description field and cyclone will automatically ID the point and add it to the control space.
In register you would Remove the old (Known Coordinate file) and add the new one, then add constraints ID only.

This will update your Registration scan with the Total stations coordinates.
James,

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Fri May 18, 2018 5:41 am

jamesworrell wrote:
Thu May 17, 2018 12:17 pm
If I understand correctly .. yes.

Did you also use targets? OR are you relying on cloud-to-cloud for orientation?

Either way you need to create "constraints" between the scans for the registration.

First step is to import your TS control to create a scanworld .. simple Pt,X,Y,Z type thing. Does your measured control include height of instrument - that is did you measure with a prism and smart handle on top of scanner and put that in as height of target? Or did you measure via normal traverse, and have a height of target off the ground? If ground, add to match the height of instrument - assuming you did standard setup on the scanner - so the centre of the scan is 0,0,0. StdSetup is 0,0,0 at scanner centre - you just need "control" to match.

Probably a few ways to tackle the next step - and someone more enlightened might have an easier way.

If you have targets - skip this bit - just use the target coordinates .. that is a different answer. Assuming no targets ..:

In each scan - create a vertex at 0,0,0 and add a Registration Label that matches it's control point ID - needs to match exactly - also case sensitive. (You could go -Z offset here to match the ground position as opposed to adding the instrument height in previous step)

How big is the site? Are you planning on using ground distance coordinates or grid/geodetic coordinates? Or are you looking to apply a scale factor to the rtk coordinates? I assume you haven't used a P40 here and applied a scale factor during scanning ..

We typically pick a scale point and calculate a scale factor .. to translate the GPS coords to ground.

Going with ground .. you should have a control scanworld with the control points matching the instrument centres on a local assumed system.

Create a registration.

Add the control scanworld.

Add the other scanworlds.

Auto-add constraints - target ID only. This should basically match up the scanner centre with your control by name. Now you haven't got a rotation for the scan unless you also used targets. Then you head into the cloud-to-cloud world .. visual align .. wizard .. take your pick. You can give this a lesser weight to ensure the total station values have a higher priority.

So once you have the cloud-to-cloud added - you have constraints for the centre and rotation from cloud .. You can auto-add cloud as well.

Freeze rego .. you are on local coords .. audit it.

Next - to get to a pseudo real world - albeit ground distance coordinates .. pick one of the RTK positions - probably near the middle (we usually aim for a permanent survey mark) .. calculate the azimuth to a second - prob furthest away .. you can then set coordinates by 2 points .. pick point 1 (middle) .. then 2 .. run the command .. type in coords .. type in bearing .. done.

Set default scan world coords .. save the coord system etc.

If you want to use RTK across the thing and try and stretch/shrink the data .. instead of TS control - use the RTK coords. You might put more weight on the cloud-to-cloud then and average the overall position. There is no nice way to do this and to be honest - never had to try.

Hope this helps.

Hi James

First of all, thanks for your reply.

The orientation is given by C2C.

It includes a 360 prism on a smart handle, where the distance to the instrument is known, so that i have a known height of the instrument.
After i have none the prism measurement, i change that to my RTK antenna, so i have a global coordinate.
Do i have to go into each scan manually to create a new vertex? For some of this scanjobs i got 200 stations?
Isnt there some way, where i just adds them as constraints and can apply the txt coordinate file to all 200 at once?

And i use a leica p20 scanner with a max to 30m, so the quality should be really good.

But if i got 200 rtk measurements and want to use an least squares adjustment, this command wont apply?

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Fri May 18, 2018 5:45 am

James Hall wrote:
Thu May 17, 2018 3:30 pm
In cyclone you can replace the Known Coordinate Scan world. The RTK coordinates or the Total station coordinates would be interchangeable.
Navigator window, file Import txt file. (.svy) It has formatting options you will have to play around with to get your Nothing, Easting and Units right.
Specify "Target ID" as you description field and cyclone will automatically ID the point and add it to the control space.
In register you would Remove the old (Known Coordinate file) and add the new one, then add constraints ID only.

This will update your Registration scan with the Total stations coordinates.
James,
Oh, so basically i can just handle the station coordinate, as an target?
So it should work, if i import the stationfile and apply it to the scanworld, by a constraint target, use the rtk file as homescanworld and give that one a minimal weight?

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by James Hall » Fri May 18, 2018 4:33 pm

Yes the total station coordinate comes in as a target vertex. Setting the wight on your constraints to .05 is what I would recommend. It is the lowest setting that will force a rotation translation and still has some wiggle room.

James,

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Tue May 22, 2018 7:16 am

James Hall wrote:
Fri May 18, 2018 4:33 pm
Yes the total station coordinate comes in as a target vertex. Setting the wight on your constraints to .05 is what I would recommend. It is the lowest setting that will force a rotation translation and still has some wiggle room.

James,
Thanks! i will try it out!

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:44 am

Hi All

I have now scanned 13 stations with the pærism on top and measured to my prism, with a totalstation.
I import the scanstations as useal and import the measurements as a regular targetfile. I have checked the setting; Add verrtex to scanner location.

I create a registration but it cant match the targetfile with the scanlocations, even though, they have the same name (SW-001, SW-002 etc).
Can any of you guys make a quick video that shows the principe?

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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by James Hall » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:14 pm

Hello,
With each of your setups you needed to record a Instrument Height for your prism. I'm attaching images to illustrate the process.

Open your control file in Notepad. If there is a header delete it and if you are having problems with .txt importing change the extension to .svy.
Make sure your Northing and Easting are defined correctly in the import utility.
Control.txt file.jpg
450LH,6944696.770,11868435.308,109.263,NS
451LH,6944505.230,11868299.270,105.407,NS
452LH,6944570.791,11868461.450,107.698,NS
453LH,6944621.873,11868248.679,103.526,NS
Import1.jpg
Import2.jpg
Import2A.jpg
Import3.jpg

When you import your file and it is still not picking up the Target ID you can Manually assign them.
manually assigning target ID.jpg
You will need to set the HI for Each Target in the Control space.
Set HI.jpg
Each setup control space will have a vertex at the scanner head position. You will need to determine the offset between Prism and this vertex. This scanner position vertex also needs a Reg ID and HI applied to it.


Any vertex in Register can be constrained to another. If you can't get anything to work you can always select two vertexes and add a constraint by right clicking to pull up the menu.
Manually assigning a constraint.jpg
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MalteHC
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Re: Registration in cyclone with scanpositions and RTK

Post by MalteHC » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:23 am

I tried, but when i do my registration, does my targets get the error of their own coordinate, because they a in a georefrenced system and my scanworlds is in a local. This seems pretty strange for me, doing to, it is the same exercise as useal.

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